Righteous Wrath Online Community

My laptop is starting to fall apart. So I figure its time to start looking into a new one.

I've been looking into hp and lenovo's. The HP probooks look ok, but the options are a bit /meh/ for the price. But the lenovo W530 looks pretty good to me. T530 is good too, but it seems for the money the W530 is a better bet (it can be upgraded a bit further for the same money).

Was wondering if you guys had any suggestions. Good linux support is an absolute must.

I absolutely love my Asus Gamers... but I am not sure about the linux support. The HP Elite Books are very nice that we get at work and they do work well with Ubuntu (people in the office are running it).  I have this one: http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/sm/WF06a/321957-321957-64295-3740645-3955549-5212912.html?dnr=1, even comes with a serial port on the back (/shock).

I have not heard good things about the MSI Gaming lappies that MemEx has on sale.  Dell XPS Laptops are also very well built now as the Latitude line of laptops they have are going out the door, XPS replacing them.  Again those should be good for Linux support.

I've not seen a new HP laptop since 2010 but back then there were a lot of quality control problems from what I remember.

My sister in law has an ASUS and the only real issue was heat generation (which was to be expected given the video card).

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 22, 2013, 02:19:17 PM
I've not seen a new HP laptop since 2010 but back then there were a lot of quality control problems from what I remember.

Take a walk through NAIT, we're HP central for all your browsing needs :P. 

All I can say is make sure you get a powerful enough laptop - you make some cash, don't need to scrimp.  A computer is a business write-off for you anyway.  But cheaping out on video capabilities will piss you off in six months' time.

Quote from: Melbosa on January 22, 2013, 02:23:54 PM

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 22, 2013, 02:19:17 PM
I've not seen a new HP laptop since 2010 but back then there were a lot of quality control problems from what I remember.

Take a walk through NAIT, we're HP central for all your browsing needs :P

They went through 6 months of RMAing workstation laptops interally so :P back to you, even their IT department was upset about it.

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 22, 2013, 02:25:56 PM

Quote from: Melbosa on January 22, 2013, 02:23:54 PM

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 22, 2013, 02:19:17 PM
I've not seen a new HP laptop since 2010 but back then there were a lot of quality control problems from what I remember.

Take a walk through NAIT, we're HP central for all your browsing needs :P

They went through 6 months of RMAing workstation laptops interally so :P back to you, even their IT department was upset about it.

The laptops in the Elite series seem to be very solid IMO.  No issues I know of and half the department has them.  The older HP lappies... yeah they had issues. I won't deny that.

I can't remember what they were called but they were pretty high end for workstations in 2010 (multi-core, min 8 G of memory)

I Wonder if Outright Routine Killed Everyone's Data And Took Hope away Permenantly

*cough*

Quote from: Thorin on January 22, 2013, 02:24:12 PM
All I can say is make sure you get a powerful enough laptop - you make some cash, don't need to scrimp.  A computer is a business write-off for you anyway.  But cheaping out on video capabilities will piss you off in six months' time.

Indeed, which is why I'm seriously considering the Lenovo W530 with the Quadro K2000M. The T530 only has a 5400M which is like half the performance.

A gaming laptop might be the way to go, but I also want something fairly rugged.

One problem with nvidia graphics that I'll be ignoring is the lack of optimus support. Probably just disable it in the bios and force the discreet gpu, just because.

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 22, 2013, 02:30:26 PM
I can't remember what they were called but they were pretty high end for workstations in 2010 (multi-core, min 8 G of memory)

I Wonder if Outright Routine Killed Everyone's Data And Took Hope away Permenantly

*cough*

Lawl.

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 22, 2013, 02:30:26 PM
I can't remember what they were called but they were pretty high end for workstations in 2010 (multi-core, min 8 G of memory)

I Wonder if Outright Routine Killed Everyone's Data And Took Hope away Permenantly

*cough*

Yeah the Elites are a new series rebrand as of 2012.  New hardware, new design.

Prior to these I would NOT have recommend an HP, knowing "someone's" experience while working somewhere, and what we went through at NAIT.

Quote from: Tom on January 22, 2013, 02:33:37 PM
A gaming laptop might be the way to go, but I also want something fairly rugged.

One problem with nvidia graphics that I'll be ignoring is the lack of optimus support. Probably just disable it in the bios and force the discreet gpu, just because.

Two weeks after I bought my last Asus, I slipped on ice with it in my backpack.  It saved my neck and head from hitting the ground.  All I had to do was snap back in some plastic and it was all good (nothing broken or chipped).  While some of it was the backpack, I can tell you it was definitely rugged and robust in the physical sense. 

It's predecessor (which you have used) still plays every game on the planet and is my main business laptop - if that isn't longevity I don't know what is.

And the Asus laptops come with nVidia or ATI, depends on the model.

Quote from: Melbosa on January 22, 2013, 02:42:08 PM

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 22, 2013, 02:30:26 PM
I can't remember what they were called but they were pretty high end for workstations in 2010 (multi-core, min 8 G of memory)

I Wonder if Outright Routine Killed Everyone's Data And Took Hope away Permenantly

*cough*

Yeah the Elites are a new series rebrand as of 2012.  New hardware, new design.

Prior to these I would NOT have recommend an HP, knowing "someone's" experience while working somewhere, and what we went through at NAIT.

Quote from: Tom on January 22, 2013, 02:33:37 PM
A gaming laptop might be the way to go, but I also want something fairly rugged.

One problem with nvidia graphics that I'll be ignoring is the lack of optimus support. Probably just disable it in the bios and force the discreet gpu, just because.

Two weeks after I bought my last Asus, I slipped on ice with it in my backpack.  It saved my neck and head from hitting the ground.  All I had to do was snap back in some plastic and it was all good (nothing broken or chipped).  While some of it was the backpack, I can tell you it was definitely rugged and robust in the physical sense. 

It's predecessor (which you have used) still plays every game on the planet and is my main business laptop - if that isn't longevity I don't know what is.

And the Asus laptops come with nVidia or ATI, depends on the model.

They aren't very configurable. In fact the selection seems to suck. I don't need it to come with a lot of hdd space or memory since I'll be upgrading to 16GB ram and an SSD right away. Also the cpu choice on ncix is crap.

Weird, HP lists /one/ non configurable Elite Book on their site. And its a 17" :o

Quote from: Tom on January 22, 2013, 02:54:01 PM
Weird, HP lists /one/ non configurable Elite Book on their site. And its a 17" :o

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/ca/en/sm/WF04a/321957-321957-64295-3955549-3955549.html?dnr=1

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/ca/en/sm/WF25a/321957-321957-64295-3955549-3955549-5212912.html?dnr=1

I have an 8570p at work myself.  Seems like they have a few skus to pick from and a few choices for the sku.

Quote from: Melbosa on January 22, 2013, 03:12:23 PM

Quote from: Tom on January 22, 2013, 02:54:01 PM
Weird, HP lists /one/ non configurable Elite Book on their site. And its a 17" :o

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/ca/en/sm/WF04a/321957-321957-64295-3955549-3955549.html?dnr=1

http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/ca/en/sm/WF25a/321957-321957-64295-3955549-3955549-5212912.html?dnr=1

I have an 8570p at work myself.  Seems like they have a few skus to pick from and a few choices for the sku.

That's weird. I searched for EliteBook on their site, and I got one result. I tried to find it from their main products page and didn't find much of anything. They might need to do something about that.

So it looks like I'll go with the Lenovo W530 as configured:

Intel Core i7-3720QM Processor (6M Cache, up to 3.60 GHz)
Windows 8 Pro 64
15.6" FHD (1920 x 1080) LED Backlit AntiGlare Display, Mobile Broadband Ready
NVIDIA Quadro K2000M Graphics with 2GB DDR3 Memory
8 GB DDR3 - 1600MHz (2 DIMM)
UltraNav with Fingerprint Reader
500GB Hard Disk Drive, 7200rpm
DVD Recordable 8x Max, Dual Layer, Ultrabay Enhanced w/ SW Royalty for Windows 8
9 Cell Li-Ion TWL 70++
Bluetooth 4.0 with Antenna
Intel Centrino Ultimate-N 6300 AGN
Mobile Broadband upgradable
3YR Onsite Next Business Day + Accidental Damage Protection + Priority Technical Support

I'll then upgrade the hard drive and ram once I get it. 240G SSD and 16GB ram (might delay on the ram, 8GB will probably be enough to start with). May even install a second ssd if I need more space in the ultrabay, but I'll keep the DVD-R for now.

The main reason for this choice? Its a kick ass laptop, and lenovo just gave me a 10% coupon. which brings this config with the extended warranty to under $2000.

Thanks for the input guys. Though if you can find a better laptop (given my requirements) for the same (or at least close) or better price, please let me know.

That looks like it kicks ass! Great find, also 10% is a bonus.

Too bad you have to pay the Windows Tax though

Quote from: Mr. Analog on January 24, 2013, 09:34:49 AM
That looks like it kicks ass! Great find, also 10% is a bonus.

Too bad you have to pay the Windows Tax though

Yeah. I think I can get them to give me a refund for that, but it may require either proving I didn't accept the EULA, or sending it back for them to wipe it. So I won't bother.

append: ooh, its actually 12%. but yeah. awesome.

Good find.  Beats the Asus on the battery life, but does cost more.  The Quadro is more Linux friendly for sure than the GeForce products.

How much would you get back if you didn't accept Windows?  I know back in the day OEMs only paid, like, twenty bucks to include an OEM copy of Windows on a computer...

It depends if it comes pre-installed, wiping it takes time and time is money.

Why not save $20 anyway, buy a giant steak instead of Windows 8?

The HP laptops Melbosa pointed to had an option to take Suse or FreeDOS, and at least with FreeDOS, you saved $100. Maybe that discount gets smaller if you also buy office and stuff, but since its more of a business laptop, probably not?

Just got a shipment notification for my new laptop \o/ Hopefully get it by early next week.

Aww yeah. Got my laptop today \o/ a day late, but meh.

It's pretty slick, especially after the upgrade to 24GB ram, and a blazing fast SSD (500MBps reads and writes).

Transferred all the important stuff off my old laptop, and have the new one all set up. I'ma happy.

Gratz....

Woo! Get Steam & Minecraft on that sucker!

Quote from: Mr. Analog on February 08, 2013, 04:04:49 PM
Woo! Get Steam & Minecraft on that sucker!

Minecraft is already on this sucker (just working on getting oracle-java installed, they changed the license, which no longer allowed distros to ship it). No steam though, last I tried the steam client didn't like debian very much.

Bwah bwuh!

Hopefully they can get it running on that distro so we can play games!

Gotta do co-op Portal 2!!

Quote from: Tom on February 08, 2013, 03:54:04 PM
Aww yeah. Got my laptop today \o/ a day late, but meh.

It's pretty slick, especially after the upgrade to 24GB ram, and a blazing fast SSD (500MBps reads and writes).

Transferred all the important stuff off my old laptop, and have the new one all set up. I'ma happy.

I think that's more RAM than in my entire house. Well, if w don't count stuff built into phones, I guess.

Quote from: Mr. Analog on February 08, 2013, 04:36:47 PM
Bwah bwuh!

Hopefully they can get it running on that distro so we can play games!

Gotta do co-op Portal 2!!

Aww yeah. That'd be cool.

Quote from: Thorin on February 08, 2013, 04:54:58 PM

Quote from: Tom on February 08, 2013, 03:54:04 PM
Aww yeah. Got my laptop today \o/ a day late, but meh.

It's pretty slick, especially after the upgrade to 24GB ram, and a blazing fast SSD (500MBps reads and writes).

Transferred all the important stuff off my old laptop, and have the new one all set up. I'ma happy.

I think that's more RAM than in my entire house. Well, if w don't count stuff built into phones, I guess.

Yeah, it came with 8GB, and I bought a pair of 8GB sticks to put in the empty slots. I could have gone to 32GB, but meh. If I find I need more than 24GB ram, I'll do it then. Or if the ram is on sale stupid cheap ;D

I am surprised you didn't go Ubuntu on the laptop. They have decent decent WiFi tools and I have found its repo to be WAY more current than Debian even when using older LTS releases.

Quote from: Lazybones on February 08, 2013, 08:18:11 PM
I am surprised you didn't go Ubuntu on the laptop. They have decent decent WiFi tools and I have found its repo to be WAY more current than Debian even when using older LTS releases.

Ubuntu likes to break, and force crazy changes when ever the mood hits them. Heck, they are thinking about developing their own display server to replace X now. It's just.. ughgh.

I use Debian Sid though, which is generally more up to date than Ubuntu, since Ubuntu is branched off of Debian Sid every 6 months. Ubuntu is a combination of the worst aspects of Debian Stable, and Debian Sid. You get untimely updates (every 6 months), and things can be rather unstable.

Odd since I found common apps like transmission be more current, and completely up to date if you used PPA repos which many projects seem to be supporting for Ubuntu .

Sticking to Ubuntu LTS over cutting edge seems to be both stable and allows you to have current apps.

Quote from: Lazybones on February 08, 2013, 08:58:52 PM
Odd since I found common apps like transmission be more current, and completely up to date if you used PPA repos which many projects seem to be supporting for Ubuntu .

Sticking to Ubuntu LTS over cutting edge seems to be both stable and allows you to have current apps.

Except PPAs aren't part of the distro. It'd be like me pulling out of random repos, just hoping it'll work and not break anything. Compare a stock Ubuntu distro to a stock Sid.

I'm really not a fan of the direction Ubuntu is heading. And last I ran it, I had to switch mere months after I installed it because it was broken and out dated.

Quote from: Tom on February 08, 2013, 09:10:34 PM

Quote from: Lazybones on February 08, 2013, 08:58:52 PM
Odd since I found common apps like transmission be more current, and completely up to date if you used PPA repos which many projects seem to be supporting for Ubuntu .

Sticking to Ubuntu LTS over cutting edge seems to be both stable and allows you to have current apps.

Except PPAs aren't part of the distro. It'd be like me pulling out of random repos, just hoping it'll work and not break anything. Compare a stock Ubuntu distro to a stock Sid.

I'm really not a fan of the direction Ubuntu is heading. And last I ran it, I had to switch mere months after I installed it because it was broken and out dated.

Fair enough if you don't like it, the PPA repo's seem to use the same package management protections so if there is no build for your release by default it should not install as far as I understand it. Also if you are on LTS your chances of compatibility seem to be the greatest.

transmission-daemon

Debian Repo	Ubuntu Repo	Ubuntu Direct PPA	Official released source
squeeze (stable) 2.03	The Precise Pangolin (supported) 2.51	2.76	2.76
wheezy (testing) 2.52	The Quantal Quetzal (current stable release) 2.61	2.76	2.76
sid (unstable) 2.52	The Raring Ringtail (active development) 2.76	2.76	2.76

ZNC

Debian Repo	Ubuntu Repo	Ubuntu Backports	Official released source
squeeze (stable) 0.092	The Precise Pangolin (supported) 0.206	1.0	1.0
wheezy (testing) 0.206	The Quantal Quetzal (current stable release) 0.206	1.0	1.0
sid (unstable) 0.206	The Raring Ringtail (active development) 1.0	1.0	1.0

libreoffice

Debian Repo	Ubuntu Repo	Official released source / installer
squeeze (stable) 1:3.5.4	The Precise Pangolin (supported) 1:3.5.4	4.0
wheezy (testing) 1:3.5.4	The Quantal Quetzal (current stable release) 1:3.6.2	4.0
sid (unstable) 1:3.5.4	The Raring Ringtail (active development) 1:3.6.2	4.0

As far as I have seen the Ubuntu STABLE release repo is always more up to date than SID and the LTS long term support OLD release of ubuntu is about on par with SID but can be more up to date with a  PPA repo.

Plex runs an official PPA for Ubuntu which is really handy... there is someone in the forums that runs an unofficial Debia Repo that is at least a week or two behind the official releases as he fixes the start-up scripts.

That's not what I found. I'd have to wait months and months for the next ubuntu release to get a newer Xorg or KDE or something like that. Where as sid/experimental would at least get the X stuff sooner. Can't talk about KDE though, debian's kde is way behind. But its stable.

I've found debian does a pretty good job of that. Things don't often break. And it seems to me that they don't upgrade willy-nilly to new versions just because they are there. Usually they don't because there's some issue with them. Like with the kde-pim packages. New kmail in there that ate a bunch of my mail settings and was generally crap at the time. And they still haven't updated to kmail2 yet. And its been quite a while since kmail2 was officially released.

That said, I do hear of (big) breakages in Ubuntu fairly regularly.

I've started to care a lot more about my system being stable, so I don't have to fight with brokenness. I still like to have non-ancient packages, but its not as important as it once was to have the newest and shiniest versions.