No really, it is good news. Shaw has announced their new internet plans and pricing going forward. As well as how they are going to get there.
http://shaw.ca/newpackages/?WT.mc_id=C995A2047S98
That's the new plans. The Phase 1 plans will roll out on June 7th.
As for the Phase 2 plans, those depend on network upgrades. They are killing analog cable above "basic cable". Which frees up a large portion of their bandwidth, and will be appropriating a lot of it for the new 100/250mb plans.
WTF those limits and speeds kinda make sense! Note that the 1Mbit plan is unlimited hehe
I'm confused, where's the evil part???
Quote from: Mr. Analog on May 26, 2011, 12:18:25 AM
I'm confused, where's the evil part???
Thats the funny part. Shaw identifies itself as non evil. They were quite surprised at the backlash, and have tried to correct the mistakes they were making by following the eastern canadian/american ISPs.
Sadly they haven't completely fixed everything. You'll notice that you can't currently get the new Broadband plans without TV. There is just no option to NOT get TV with them.
Quote from: Tom on May 26, 2011, 01:24:09 AM
Sadly they haven't completely fixed everything. You'll notice that you can't currently get the new Broadband plans without TV. There is just no option to NOT get TV with them.
I noticed that, and the price / speed do not line up with the current plans that they are upping the limits on...
however the Phase 2 upload speeds are really impressive, and if you think about it the top plan 250 Mbps/15 Mbps/unlimited is actually impressive if you have ever had to try and price out a connection with upload speeds that high.
Unlimited
Hopefully it is actually unlimited and not "unlimited" (as in an arbitrarily high-sounding number that actually isn't that high at all)
:D
Quote from: Mr. Analog on May 26, 2011, 07:44:31 AM
Hopefully it is actually unlimited and not "unlimited" (as in an arbitrarily high-sounding number that actually isn't that high at all)
:D
Is that arbitrarily high limit you're thinking of anywhere near the 1TB limit on the plan before the unlimited one?
They still need to get rid of bandwidth caps, and simply charge people for throughput speed. They're three fourths of the way there now, just need to take that last step. Unlimited for all, pay for speed.
The prices seem pretty high, though. Expect that with the bigger packages you'll be paying in the range of $200 to $300 for Cable, Phone, and Internet bundled. If you truly get the advertised speeds, that's okay because you won't need the bigger packages to get the speed you're getting today. But if they don't manage to actually make, say, the Broadband 50 package twice as fast as the current Extreme package, then it's just good money thrown after bad.
I really wish they had the option of Bare Broadband 50. Then it should only be like $60-70 and I can deal with that. $89 is a wee much. And I really don't care about thier digital TV service since I can't record a damn thing on it with my own PVR.
The Future is the Shaw Gateway.
It allows you to pause a live TV stream on one TV and start it on another. We've got Telus TV, which allows that, and it works very well. The big difference between Telus TV and Shaw Gateway will be the number of live streams you can have coming in - Telus TV advertises that you can have three streams coming in (two HD, although in our area the network is old and we only get one), whereas Shaw Gateway is advertised as capable of six streams (all HD) at the same time.
The idea of "streams" really threw me at first, being used to the old concept of all channels on a single cable and your local device tunes to the correct frequency. With Telus TV and Shaw Gateway, it's basically IPTV, so you just get the programming on the channel you're watching (or recording) sent to your house.
Eh. I don't want and can't afford to pay for regular TV without being able to use my existing PVR. I deffintely can't afford the full cost of the gateway or home portal's, or even the added rental fee on top of the internet+tv charges.
Not gunna happen. Also, shaw still does all of its Digital TV and VoD/MovieClub stuff over QAM/Digital cable. It has no immediate plans for IPTV. I'm betting the Total Home Portal connects to the Gateway via coax, and streams a single digital signal over that. The Gateway may have wifi support and 4 Ethernet ports, but the portals themselves don't have ethernet. So the only way they can connect is over Wifi or Coax afaik. And I really doubt Wifi G has enough bandwidth for 6 HD video streams. Heck even 2-3 would be pushing it.
I think this is an interim step toward a new VOD service (one that doesn't suck ass, that is).
Cable companies have been fools letting Netflix dominate so far and with the closing of the largest national movie rental company (Blockbuster is DONE) now is the time to get a piece of the action.
IPTV through Telus is fantastic IMO. And I still HATE Telus!
/spit
You have no idea how much it hurts to say Telus and Fantastic in the same sentence. Going to go throw-up now.
You must now make a pilgrimage to 104 St and 104 Ave and genuflect in front of the sign of the ancients -> http://www.flickr.com/photos/50096214@N04/4756359897/
For ye are lost! LOST!!
Quote from: Mr. Analog on May 26, 2011, 01:37:47 PM
I think this is an interim step toward a new VOD service (one that doesn't suck ass, that is).
Cable companies have been fools letting Netflix dominate so far and with the closing of the largest national movie rental company (Blockbuster is DONE) now is the time to get a piece of the action.
They talked about thier new MovieClub service a bit. Its starting with 200 movies, including as many first run movies as they can get thier hands on. They also expect to get thier hands on a bunch of new and classic tv shows, depending on being able to make 'reasonable' deals with the tv studios.
Bassically it'll have newer movies than netflix, and get them sooner. But it's limited to a fixed 200 number, apparently something the studios and disributor insisted on. As new movies becom available, older ones will cycle off, depending on the 'window' they got a given movie for.
Yeah, that fixed number is killing them, hell the limited titles in Netflix is killing Netflix in Canada!
@%&# regional @%&#, if I had Netflix with all the titles on it I want to watch I probably wouldn't bother with torrents at all.
It's the Gateway that does all the heavy lifting, as a PVR and media server. The Total Home Portal devices are basically just receivers that can also send some commands to the Gateway PVR. The Total Home Portals can probably be connected to the Gateway PVR using Cat-5/Cat-6 ethernet cable or with coax. That's how the Telus devices work.
The Gateway PVR is the one that sees up to six live streams. Basically, it records them temporarily to its hard drive if you're watching live TV, or permanently if you have them set to record. The Total Home Portals then ask the Gateway PVR for an internal stream. That's how I understand it to work essentially, at least.
Yes, I agree with you that it will all be very expensive. I said it was Shaw's future, not that it would be cheap. I'm sure they're betting on pausing live TV being a big draw.
I wouldn't say IPTV through Telus is "fantastic". I was watching an HD live stream and an HD program was set to be recorded - when the recording started, my channel suddenly displayed "All HD services are in use". At my house, the Telus cables only support one HD stream at a time, so I couldn't watch one live stream while recording another live stream, BOO-URNS. Hell, if the kids want to record a show and I want to record a show and they're both on the HD channels, we have to pick who doesn't get their show recorded.
And don't get me started on the stupid @%&#ing letterboxing. I bought a great big TV and I've got six inch black bars to the left, to the right, above, and below! That's just retarded. Thankfully the Telus boxes allow zooming, although they don't do it right (the black bars are simply skinnier) and the zooming functions work really slowly (push the button, wait 20 seconds, see the picture resize, seriously?!).
If I can ever get my big media computer back up and running stable, I'm going back to downloading shows and viewing them via the Xbox. I'll have them in HD, without black bars, without commercials, be able to pause, rewind, and fast forward, and still be able to tape a different HD stream while watching them.
Telus's TV / Internet / Phone is significantly cheaper than Shaw's offerings. It's also not as good. But Telus has Disney Junior, with Special Agent Oso, and Shaw doesn't, so we switched so the rugrat can see his favourite show.
Oh, and anything you record to Telus's or Shaw's PVRs is encrypted so you can't just copy it off. And it won't play if your internet goes down - the boxes phone home to check that they're connected at the right customer's house, so you can't take them to a friend's place to watch the shows. In other words, Telus and Shaw are working hard at locking you down.
There's a firewire port on my Shaw PVR, apparently there's software you can get that dumps the stream off of it to the PC, though I haven't tried this...
Quote from: Tom on May 26, 2011, 12:46:09 PM
I really wish they had the option of Bare Broadband 50. Then it should only be like $60-70 and I can deal with that. $89 is a wee much. And I really don't care about thier digital TV service since I can't record a damn thing on it with my own PVR.
Since I need neither cabletv nor home phone, this new plan prices me out -- stuck with Telus now. fml.
I am sorry your experience hasn't been great with Telus. I guess am blessed with more up-to-date infrastructure in my area, and therefore I don't experience the streaming issues you do. I am able to record and watch HD at the same time, on multiple units, without issue. I'm sure with Shaw solution infrastructure will be a similar problem... new tech over old lines.
I also do not experience the same letterbox issue you do. I get full 1080p with no black lines on my HD channels, no zoom or setup required with the set top box, and my TV reports 1080p signal. I have found, if my TV doesn't boot up fast enough, that I will get the letterbox you describe, but I only experienced that a couple of time (TV didn't get power on signal, so second try on Harmony got it powered on), and changing the channel fixed the issue (and back if I wanted to watch starting channel). My TV though is older, DLP model, and doesn't have the new tech/rates, so could be that (just a guess).
Hopefully you can get some help from Telus.
That letterbox issue is sometimes the fault of the source stream, though I haven't noticed it on Shaw (unless I was on an SDTV channel)
Are you able to record/view two or three HD live streams (channels) at the same time? Mine I can only record/view one HD live stream at a time (plus two more SD live streams). Try recording two, three, four separate HD channels and you'll eventually get the same warning that only so many live streams are possible.
The letterboxing is happening on SD channels that are showing HD content. So first the side bars come up because it's an SD channel, then the SD channel has HD content on it so it includes the top and bottom bars. And voila, I'm watching a 32" show on a 50" TV. HD is showing in 720p (perfect for my 720p plasma). Yes, I know, that's because of the content. I've also had it get stuck a couple of times where the HD stream is getting compressed to 4:3 mode and there's still black bars, and everyone is super-skinny.
The stupid bars are causing burn-in, though (stupid plasma, why can't you work like LCD?). With my old Shaw terminal, it was connected via component video, so I could tell the TV to stretch, zoom, etc. The Telus PVR is connected via HDMI (officially unsupported by Telus, thanks Telus installer for installing an unsupported setup), and the TV doesn't have the same picture alteration options on HDMI as it does on component connections.
I know, I can just change it myself. And I will, eventually. Although if I tell the TV to zoom, it zooms the entire picture and thus the Telus menu goes at least partially off-screen. I wish there were shortcut buttons to tell the Telus box to stretch/zoom, then I could just program those into my Harmony and have a "Picture Size" button. Because when the Telus box zooms, it doesn't zoom the menus, just the stream.
Anyway, my experience has been "meh". Yeah, we got more features (pause/rewind live TV is pretty damn cool! and we finally have HD channels) for less money ($60 to $80 less a month), but now we have to manage streams for recording, picture sizing, and put up with slower Internet speeds.
Quote from: Mr. Analog on May 26, 2011, 02:20:01 PM
There's a firewire port on my Shaw PVR, apparently there's software you can get that dumps the stream off of it to the PC, though I haven't tried this...
I somehow doubt that that port is even enabled on Shaw PVRs. And even if it was, the files are encrypted.
Quote from: Darren Dirt on May 26, 2011, 02:20:14 PM
Quote from: Tom on May 26, 2011, 12:46:09 PM
I really wish they had the option of Bare Broadband 50. Then it should only be like $60-70 and I can deal with that. $89 is a wee much. And I really don't care about thier digital TV service since I can't record a damn thing on it with my own PVR.
Since I need neither cabletv nor home phone, this new plan prices me out -- stuck with Telus now. fml.
Hm, the old plans are still in place. Including Extreme, at 25/2.5. Thats not going away. And you can get it standalone for like $56.
That port on the PVR is for adding the PVR Expander, a 500GB drive that the PVR will recognize and use to store extra data.
Darren, if you don't want Telus you can certainly still get Shaw for internet. Probably costs a little more. I was more than happy with Shaw's Extreme internet speeds.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 04:20:35 PM
That port on the PVR is for adding the PVR Expander, a 500GB drive that the PVR will recognize and use to store extra data.
Darren, if you don't want Telus you can certainly still get Shaw for internet. Probably costs a little more. I was more than happy with Shaw's Extreme internet speeds.
Thats what the eSATA port on the PVR is for. Firewire is capable of much more. But usually disabled, since it can be used to stream video off the box, or potentially hack it.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 04:20:35 PM
That port on the PVR is for adding the PVR Expander, a 500GB drive that the PVR will recognize and use to store extra data.
Darren, if you don't want Telus you can certainly still get Shaw for internet. Probably costs a little more. I was more than happy with Shaw's Extreme internet speeds.
When my "$20/month first 6 months" promo ends I probably will switch... just no way I can get equiv. to the "Turbo 15" for that cheap from Shaw. The 1meg UPload is essential for me, so which Shaw plan includes that? from what I see it's like $60+ for any of them that include 1meg upload.
Quote from: Tom on May 25, 2011, 09:52:44 PM
http://shaw.ca/newpackages/?WT.mc_id=C995A2047S98
the pricing is quite unclear:
http://shaw.ca/Internet/High-Speed/ (0.5 meg upload)
http://shaw.ca/Internet/Extreme/ (2.5 meg upload)
And there's nothing in-between these.
Shaw highspeed is now 1Mbit up and extrem is 2.5 up
Quote from: Lazybones on May 27, 2011, 07:28:22 AM
Shaw highspeed is now 1Mbit up and extrem is 2.5 up
:interesting:
Telus internet package details:
http://www.telus.com/content/internet/highspeed/compare-high-speed-plans.jsp
and pricing:
http://www.telus.com/content/internet/
Note that Telus has listed an actual cost per GB for going over your monthly cap (those f---ing bastards), so you can damn well expect to be charged if you go over, and the caps are stupidly low. And I have yet to find any kind of monitoring page that'll tell me my current usage.
Shaw's view of it is 1) give bigger caps, 2) if a customer goes over automatically move them into the next plan for the month (resets back to the normal plan at the start of a new billing cycle). Granted, #2 is right now only stated as will be done with the new packages, but spending $10 to move to the new package for just the month you're over is a whole lot better than spending $200 for being 100GB over the cap.
So lets compare.
Telus: High Speed Turbo, $47 a month in bundle, $52 a month unbundled, 15Mbps up, 1Mbps down, 125GB cap, $2/GB over cap.
100GB/month: $52
150GB/month: $102 ($52 + $50 over-cap)
200GB/month: $202 ($52 + $150 over-cap)
250GB/month: $302 ($52 + $250 over-cap)
300GB/monht: $402 ($52 + $350 over-cap)
Telus: High Speed Turbo 25, $63 a month in bundle, $68 a month unbundled, 25Mbps up, 2Mbps down, 250GB cap, $2/GB over cap.
100GB/month: $68
150GB/month: $68
200GB/month: $68
250GB/month: $68
300GB/monht: $168 ($68 + $100 over-cap)
Shaw: Extreme, $49 a month in bundle, $59 a month unbundled, 25Mbps up, 2.5Mbps down, 250GB cap (new in June), no mention of $/GB over cap.
100GB/month: $59
150GB/month: $59
200GB/month: $59
250GB/month: $59
300GB/monht: $59 (unless there is a $/GB over-cap)
And they both have six-month intro rates, so you could bounce back and forth easily enough.
Man, if it wasn't for my kid wanting to see Special Agent Oso and me having spent $250 on Telus equipment I'd seriously consider moving back to Shaw and getting that Shaw Gateway... I wonder when they'll let us put together the bundle prices for the new packages.
Quote from: Thorin on May 27, 2011, 09:13:28 AM
Man, if it wasn't for my kid wanting to see Special Agent Oso and me having spent $250 on Telus equipment I'd seriously consider moving back to Shaw and getting that Shaw Gateway... I wonder when they'll let us put together the bundle prices for the new packages.
I have a spare SHAW DOCSIS 3 modem... I ended up with two of them when I moved because I had two plans for a short time.
on-topic: http://business.financialpost.com/2011/05/26/will-shaws-speed-push-threaten-telus-dividend-growth/
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
Are you able to record/view two or three HD live streams (channels) at the same time? Mine I can only record/view one HD live stream at a time (plus two more SD live streams). Try recording two, three, four separate HD channels and you'll eventually get the same warning that only so many live streams are possible.
Tested last night, and I can do 3 HD records and 1 Watch before I can no longer get an HD channel.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
The letterboxing is happening on SD channels that are showing HD content. So first the side bars come up because it's an SD channel, then the SD channel has HD content on it so it includes the top and bottom bars. And voila, I'm watching a 32" show on a 50" TV. HD is showing in 720p (perfect for my 720p plasma). Yes, I know, that's because of the content. I've also had it get stuck a couple of times where the HD stream is getting compressed to 4:3 mode and there's still black bars, and everyone is super-skinny.
Yeah never experienced the 4:3 on HD, only 720p mode with the TV power up lag, which is simple channel change back to 1080p. The SD Channel with Widescreen Content stretches for me... I get the top and bottom bars as I would on Shaw, but not the side bars. SD Channel with 4:3 Content gives me the side bars, but not the top and bottom.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
The stupid bars are causing burn-in, though (stupid plasma, why can't you work like LCD?). With my old Shaw terminal, it was connected via component video, so I could tell the TV to stretch, zoom, etc. The Telus PVR is connected via HDMI (officially unsupported by Telus, thanks Telus installer for installing an unsupported setup), and the TV doesn't have the same picture alteration options on HDMI as it does on component connections.
I haven't heard about this HDMI unsupported thing... all my devices are hooked up that way, and that was one of the questions I asked them when I got the service (not the installer but the support people at Telus), is HDMI supported. Scary if it isn't, and funny at the same time.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
I know, I can just change it myself. And I will, eventually. Although if I tell the TV to zoom, it zooms the entire picture and thus the Telus menu goes at least partially off-screen. I wish there were shortcut buttons to tell the Telus box to stretch/zoom, then I could just program those into my Harmony and have a "Picture Size" button. Because when the Telus box zooms, it doesn't zoom the menus, just the stream.
And it works automatically just fine on mine without telling it anything. Could be the differences between your Plasma and my DLP. But only a guess...
I know Cova couldn't use his XBox in 1080p mode with his HP DLP cause the XBox could not determine its 1080p ran at a different rate than most DLPs. Where as mine worked right out of the box, no change need when hooked up through HDMI.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
Anyway, my experience has been "meh". Yeah, we got more features (pause/rewind live TV is pretty damn cool! and we finally have HD channels) for less money ($60 to $80 less a month), but now we have to manage streams for recording, picture sizing, and put up with slower Internet speeds.
See I blame Shaw here. For 3 months starting January this year I called them asking what was available, what was coming and what I should expect from them to keep me with them over Telus. Never did they mention the increase in internet speeds. Never did they mention the Gateway and how it was going to work. Never did they offer up any details of plan or cost changes, and they didn't even allow me to sign up on contract for a better deal. If they had, I might not have changed.
But alas I did, and as history shows, Telus will eventually catch up on the internet side, and the service will only get better on the TV side (lucky Telus is leveraging technology of a larger digital provider in the states partnered with Cisco), and I didn't pay for my units, so I can get upgrades to the latest as I "rent" mine (for free mind you as part of my 3 year contract). I guess there I might be in a better position.
BUT I STILL HATE TELUS, and Shaw is starting to get up there on my list too.
Quote from: Mr. Analog on May 26, 2011, 02:05:28 PM
Yeah, that fixed number is killing them, hell the limited titles in Netflix is killing Netflix in Canada!
@%&# regional @%&#, if I had Netflix with all the titles on it I want to watch I probably wouldn't bother with torrents at all.
but Netflix is not just killing themselves. It's Official, Kids:
http://business.financialpost.com/2011/05/27/blockbuster-announces-locations-set-to-close/
The Canadian division of the movie and video-game rental chain was placed in receivership earlier this month after its U.S. parent filed for bankruptcy protection. It announced this week that it would close 140 locations, about one-third of its Canadian operations.
The locations which will close are as follows:
...
Edmonton
* Bonnie Doon Shopping Centre
* Meadowbrook
* Capilano Mall
* The Grange Shopping Centre
* Market at the Meadow
* Clearwater
Vancouver
* 3298 West Broadway
* Robson
* 16th & Oak
* 1887 West Broadway
Quote from: Melbosa on May 27, 2011, 02:35:37 PM
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
Are you able to record/view two or three HD live streams (channels) at the same time? Mine I can only record/view one HD live stream at a time (plus two more SD live streams). Try recording two, three, four separate HD channels and you'll eventually get the same warning that only so many live streams are possible.
Tested last night, and I can do 3 HD records and 1 Watch before I can no longer get an HD channel.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
The letterboxing is happening on SD channels that are showing HD content. So first the side bars come up because it's an SD channel, then the SD channel has HD content on it so it includes the top and bottom bars. And voila, I'm watching a 32" show on a 50" TV. HD is showing in 720p (perfect for my 720p plasma). Yes, I know, that's because of the content. I've also had it get stuck a couple of times where the HD stream is getting compressed to 4:3 mode and there's still black bars, and everyone is super-skinny.
Yeah never experienced the 4:3 on HD, only 720p mode with the TV power up lag, which is simple channel change back to 1080p. The SD Channel with Widescreen Content stretches for me... I get the top and bottom bars as I would on Shaw, but not the side bars. SD Channel with 4:3 Content gives me the side bars, but not the top and bottom.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
The stupid bars are causing burn-in, though (stupid plasma, why can't you work like LCD?). With my old Shaw terminal, it was connected via component video, so I could tell the TV to stretch, zoom, etc. The Telus PVR is connected via HDMI (officially unsupported by Telus, thanks Telus installer for installing an unsupported setup), and the TV doesn't have the same picture alteration options on HDMI as it does on component connections.
I haven't heard about this HDMI unsupported thing... all my devices are hooked up that way, and that was one of the questions I asked them when I got the service (not the installer but the support people at Telus), is HDMI supported. Scary if it isn't, and funny at the same time.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
I know, I can just change it myself. And I will, eventually. Although if I tell the TV to zoom, it zooms the entire picture and thus the Telus menu goes at least partially off-screen. I wish there were shortcut buttons to tell the Telus box to stretch/zoom, then I could just program those into my Harmony and have a "Picture Size" button. Because when the Telus box zooms, it doesn't zoom the menus, just the stream.
And it works automatically just fine on mine without telling it anything. Could be the differences between your Plasma and my DLP. But only a guess...
I know Cova couldn't use his XBox in 1080p mode with his HP DLP cause the XBox could not determine its 1080p ran at a different rate than most DLPs. Where as mine worked right out of the box, no change need when hooked up through HDMI.
Quote from: Thorin on May 26, 2011, 02:55:00 PM
Anyway, my experience has been "meh". Yeah, we got more features (pause/rewind live TV is pretty damn cool! and we finally have HD channels) for less money ($60 to $80 less a month), but now we have to manage streams for recording, picture sizing, and put up with slower Internet speeds.
See I blame Shaw here. For 3 months starting January this year I called them asking what was available, what was coming and what I should expect from them to keep me with them over Telus. Never did they mention the increase in internet speeds. Never did they mention the Gateway and how it was going to work. Never did they offer up any details of plan or cost changes, and they didn't even allow me to sign up on contract for a better deal. If they had, I might not have changed.
But alas I did, and as history shows, Telus will eventually catch up on the internet side, and the service will only get better on the TV side (lucky Telus is leveraging technology of a larger digital provider in the states partnered with Cisco), and I didn't pay for my units, so I can get upgrades to the latest as I "rent" mine (for free mind you as part of my 3 year contract). I guess there I might be in a better position.
BUT I STILL HATE TELUS, and Shaw is starting to get up there on my list too.
That's the fun part. Shaw was just coasting. They also assumed that the current behavior of the eastern ISPs was acceptable to customers. They learned a little from the whole debacle. They had only just decided on the new changes maybe a week, possibly less, before they held that meeting I went to. And it shows, they sill haven't finalized the acceptable use policy for the new plans.
Absolutely none of the new changes were even on their radar. At the first meeting they admitted to getting complacent.
Yes, I'm aware I sound like a fanboy, but I prefer to remain optimistic.
As a result of the meeting, I actually managed to talk to a tech that knew what he was talking about. He scheduled a senior on site tech for Wednesday. I really hope they fix the issues with my hookup.