Critical Drobo Alert

[Thorin]

  I hope you get that sorted out quick, Mel.

[Mr. Analog]

Eh, I need someone to give me a run up to MemEx sometime this week (maybe the weekend?)

Gotta buy a bigger HDD

[Melbosa]

Similar issues make me avoid hardware raid cards.

True hardware raid cards, consumer or business grade, have very rarely produced any problem like this in the 20+ years of using them in my experience.  I however have had to repair more than I would like to say NAS appliances in the past 4 years for faults that I wouldn't see at all in a True hardware raid solution.

Its the black-box NAS appliances that you never know if they are using a hybrid software/hardware raid (like the onboard raids on most mobos) or just a software raid of some type with a beefy sata controller and bus.

I might go to the NL40 from HP for my next NAS (or something like it if this Drobo is history or if I find myself with extra cash), which is a full computer at NAS appliance pricing and scale, with the ability to run a True hardware raid and windows OS.  Knowing HPs hardware from my experiences at work, I'll be very confident in how it will work and what to do when it goes wrong.

[Mr. Analog]

I've had two hardware RAIDs and both of them failed in an non-recoverable way. One was an on board RAID controller that just melted down and the other was an actual RAID card that just decided to erase partition info one day. Sort of soured me on the whole thing (as well I make periodic backups to ROM for really important stuff)

In both situations I had no other backup and lost quite a bit of stuff...

[Melbosa]

Well yeah, RAID is not backup, which sales people still push - was in MemEx the other day and heard a sales person refer to RAID as a full backup of your system right in your computer.... which really it is only fault-tolerance for hardware failures, not data corruption like we've experienced.

Damn I wish I hadn't just wiped my backup to start fresh..... grrrrrrrrrrrrr

Any clone drive suggestions out there?  I have access to ghost, but curious recommendations from other sources (please include the live cd or distro you are quoting when replying), thanks.

[Tom]

Well yeah, RAID is not backup, which sales people still push - was in MemEx the other day and heard a sales person refer to RAID as a full backup of your system right in your computer.... which really it is only fault-tolerance for hardware failures, not data corruption like we've experienced.

Damn I wish I hadn't just wiped my backup to start fresh..... grrrrrrrrrrrrr

Any clone drive suggestions out there?  I have access to ghost, but curious recommendations from other sources (please include the live cd or distro you are quoting when replying), thanks.

Clonezilla Live may be all you need.

It supports local, and remote disk imaging.


My main reason for avoiding hw raid is just that if you don't have an identical spare card and yours fails, you're hosed. Nothing short of thousands in data recovery (or lots of time spent trying to find a replacement card that is identical) will get your data back.

[Mr. Analog]

Yep, I've never had a drive fail before a hardware RAID...

[Tom]

Yep, I've never had a drive fail before a hardware RAID...

I'm not entirely certain what you had /was/ hardware raid mind you. Those onboard things are just software raid with some BIOS firmware allowing the system to boot off it. Many cheaper RAID cards are as well. You really only start seeing hw raid cards once you hit the $300 level.

I avoid fakeraid cards/chips like the plague. They are just plain useless. If you do have one, you're better off using it as a dumb SATA controller, and using windows's Dynamic Disks, or linux's mdraid system.

[Melbosa]

Clonezilla Live may be all you need.

It supports local, and remote disk imaging.

Thanks budy!

My main reason for avoiding hw raid is just that if you don't have an identical spare card and yours fails, you're hosed. Nothing short of thousands in data recovery (or lots of time spent trying to find a replacement card that is identical) will get your data back.

Yes and no... its the raid chip that matters.  But I see your point there... same can be said though about a NAS appliance or storage appliance, at least at the consumer level where most are not redundant parts inside.

Cheapest solution for most consumers is cloud storage, where it isn't their problem.  Next to that is a NAS appliance with own backup (burns, usb sticks, ec), and then NAS appliance with cloud backup.  Then finally is your own server with redundant parts, and backup to boot.

[Melbosa]

If you do have one, you're better off using it as a dumb SATA controller, and using windows's Dynamic Disks, or linux's mdraid system.

Windows users rejoice... Dynamic Disks as we know them a really not used anymore in 2012.  Microsoft has adopted the models of linux raid software and now your storage options in Windows 2012 will allow for many many many fully fault tolerant and resilient OS solutions.  Took 'em long enough... now just to wait for M$ to release Windows 2012!

[Thorin]

Hmm, does anyone here have any experience with FlexRAID?

http://wiki.flexraid.com/2011/09/02/what-is-flexraid/
http://wiki.flexraid.com/2011/03/26/beginners-guide-to-flexraid-2-0/

Sounds like an awesome piece of software, but who knows if it truly works, right?

[Melbosa]

Clonezilla Live may be all you need.

Have you used this before on 2TB drives?  Any idea how long a clone on a regular SATA channel would take?

[Mr. Analog]

Yep, I've never had a drive fail before a hardware RAID...

I'm not entirely certain what you had /was/ hardware raid mind you. Those onboard things are just software raid with some BIOS firmware allowing the system to boot off it. Many cheaper RAID cards are as well. You really only start seeing hw raid cards once you hit the $300 level.

I avoid fakeraid cards/chips like the plague. They are just plain useless. If you do have one, you're better off using it as a dumb SATA controller, and using windows's Dynamic Disks, or linux's mdraid system.

Ah the first one was an onboard RAID controller built into the motherboard.

The second one was an expansion card with its own power.

Either way, both failed due to RAID corrupting and NOT the drives.

I also had a situation where I borked a software RAID back in '08 but that was PEBKAC and not the controllers fault.

[Melbosa]

Hmm, does anyone here have any experience with FlexRAID?

http://wiki.flexraid.com/2011/09/02/what-is-flexraid/
http://wiki.flexraid.com/2011/03/26/beginners-guide-to-flexraid-2-0/

Sounds like an awesome piece of software, but who knows if it truly works, right?

Hehe, welcome to native support for above in Window 2012.  And RC is free to download right now if you want to check out.


We tested FlexRAID at work and found it had quite a performance hit when doing JBODs under the covers.  While it worked and fully supported and never lost I/O its IOPS was not very pleasing.  Not sure if you could say Transcode from a read of this source in real time.

[Thorin]

Oh, and CloneZilla works nicely.  Or you could just ddrescue them?  Either or, both are free