Windows 8 - Some of the new Features

[Mr. Analog]

That's my feeling basically, I mean a doorknob is a great interface for a door but imagine trying to drive a car with a doorknob. Doesn't make sense.

Unless you are Salvador Dali, in which case the car is the interface for the doorknob.

(as an aside: in many ways I'm glad I don't have access to stronger medication)

[Thorin]

I just wanna say the software is not forced on you.  You could keep an old copy of Windows XP that you bought separately from the hardware hanging around, and whenever you bought a new piece of hardware you could install the old OS on it.  Or you could go for Linux, where you can actually pick what pieces you want compiled into your OS - you'd be able to keep that the same forever!

Now, if you want to complain about pre-installed software on a new piece of hardware that you bought, that's a different story.  I hate all the extra stuff that gets installed to "improve the experience".  Of course, as a tech-savvy user I tend to just format the drive and then install the software I want (including OS) when I get new hardware.  You could do the same, no?

As for not wanting to invest time in trying out new tech (hard or soft), it kinda comes with the field you're in.  IT and software development are rapidly evolving fields, and those of us in these fields need to keep up with the changes.  That's just the nature of this beast.  As opposed to garbage truck drivers, whose jobs have stayed pretty much the same for over 40 years (pick up the bin, empty it, put it back down).

All that said, yeah, the change in how users interact with the OS does cause some short- and medium-term pain and that sucks.  Of course, when we force people to switch from paper-based systems that they know to computerized systems that they don't know there's just as much or more pain, yet when is the last time any of us has argued against computerizing a task and leaving it paper-based?  Hell, most of our work is computerizing previously-paper-based tasks!

note: as I was typing this two new replies came in, and I do agree that making the tablet OS be the desktop and laptop OS doesn't make any sense until all desktops and laptops have multi-touch screens attached to them.  Even then, there are currently still significant differences in the tasks people do on desktops versus tablets, and a physical keyboard still outweighs a virtual keyboard in every category except portability.

[Tom]

I just wanna say the software is not forced on you.  You could keep an old copy of Windows XP that you bought separately from the hardware hanging around, and whenever you bought a new piece of hardware you could install the old OS on it.  Or you could go for Linux, where you can actually pick what pieces you want compiled into your OS - you'd be able to keep that the same forever!

Now, if you want to complain about pre-installed software on a new piece of hardware that you bought, that's a different story.  I hate all the extra stuff that gets installed to "improve the experience".  Of course, as a tech-savvy user I tend to just format the drive and then install the software I want (including OS) when I get new hardware.  You could do the same, no?

As for not wanting to invest time in trying out new tech (hard or soft), it kinda comes with the field you're in.  IT and software development are rapidly evolving fields, and those of us in these fields need to keep up with the changes.  That's just the nature of this beast.  As opposed to garbage truck drivers, whose jobs have stayed pretty much the same for over 40 years (pick up the bin, empty it, put it back down).

All that said, yeah, the change in how users interact with the OS does cause some short- and medium-term pain and that sucks.  Of course, when we force people to switch from paper-based systems that they know to computerized systems that they don't know there's just as much or more pain, yet when is the last time any of us has argued against computerizing a task and leaving it paper-based?  Hell, most of our work is computerizing previously-paper-based tasks!

note: as I was typing this two new replies came in, and I do agree that making the tablet OS be the desktop and laptop OS doesn't make any sense until all desktops and laptops have multi-touch screens attached to them.  Even then, there are currently still significant differences in the tasks people do on desktops versus tablets, and a physical keyboard still outweighs a virtual keyboard in every category except portability.

I'm allowed to complain about whatever I want, when ever I want

As a public figure MS has to expect criticism. Now whether they accept it or take it into consideration (they certainly don't have to) is a different story.

[Mr. Analog]

Exactly Tom, exactly. The whole "no one is forcing you to use it" argument is an old one, of course they aren't forcing anyone to do anything but that's not the point, the point is the emperor has no clothes (at least by my point of view). Whether or not my opinion matters is a matter of your own opinion

I think if we had touch screens on our desktops it would make a lot more sense, I feel like in a few years or so someone like Apple will have that kind of functionality and make it look cool, but for me? Keyboard shortcuts, a desktop I never look at ever and a Start Menu work just fine.

[Thorin]

Multi-touch all-in-one machines are slowly seeping into the marketplace.  My in-laws have a Windows-based HP - Win7, but HP added some whiz-banggery multi-touch overlay that you can start up.  Otherwise the screen functions as single-touch with where you touch equal to a mouse-click.  They've had it for over a year.

[Tom]

Multi-touch all-in-one machines are slowly seeping into the marketplace.  My in-laws have a Windows-based HP - Win7, but HP added some whiz-banggery multi-touch overlay that you can start up.  Otherwise the screen functions as single-touch with where you touch equal to a mouse-click.  They've had it for over a year.

I'm just not sure how useful that would be for an actual desktop computer. That is, one you use to do actual work.

For a kitchen pc or something like that? A touchscreen would be great.

[Mr. Analog]

Multi-touch all-in-one machines are slowly seeping into the marketplace.  My in-laws have a Windows-based HP - Win7, but HP added some whiz-banggery multi-touch overlay that you can start up.  Otherwise the screen functions as single-touch with where you touch equal to a mouse-click.  They've had it for over a year.

I'm just not sure how useful that would be for an actual desktop computer. That is, one you use to do actual work.

For a kitchen pc or something like that? A touchscreen would be great.

I think it has potential, especially after having used a tablet for a year now. I mean I'd love to just tap the screen to pause a video or change the volume. Editing PowerShell scripts not so much...

I'll tell you one thing though, with touch-y screen technology advancing companies like Wacom better watch their asses.

[Tom]

Multi-touch all-in-one machines are slowly seeping into the marketplace.  My in-laws have a Windows-based HP - Win7, but HP added some whiz-banggery multi-touch overlay that you can start up.  Otherwise the screen functions as single-touch with where you touch equal to a mouse-click.  They've had it for over a year.

I'm just not sure how useful that would be for an actual desktop computer. That is, one you use to do actual work.

For a kitchen pc or something like that? A touchscreen would be great.

I think it has potential, especially after having used a tablet for a year now. I mean I'd love to just tap the screen to pause a video or change the volume. Editing PowerShell scripts not so much...

I dunno. I really can't see me wanting to reach over and touch my screens to do things. I sit kinda far away from my dual 24" setup. I can't even reach them from where I'm sitting right now. Not without leaning forward quite a bit.

[Mr. Analog]

Multi-touch all-in-one machines are slowly seeping into the marketplace.  My in-laws have a Windows-based HP - Win7, but HP added some whiz-banggery multi-touch overlay that you can start up.  Otherwise the screen functions as single-touch with where you touch equal to a mouse-click.  They've had it for over a year.

I'm just not sure how useful that would be for an actual desktop computer. That is, one you use to do actual work.

For a kitchen pc or something like that? A touchscreen would be great.

I think it has potential, especially after having used a tablet for a year now. I mean I'd love to just tap the screen to pause a video or change the volume. Editing PowerShell scripts not so much...

I dunno. I really can't see me wanting to reach over and touch my screens to do things. I sit kinda far away from my dual 24" setup. I can't even reach them from where I'm sitting right now. Not without leaning forward quite a bit.

That seems more a problem with the user and not the software

[Tom]

Multi-touch all-in-one machines are slowly seeping into the marketplace.  My in-laws have a Windows-based HP - Win7, but HP added some whiz-banggery multi-touch overlay that you can start up.  Otherwise the screen functions as single-touch with where you touch equal to a mouse-click.  They've had it for over a year.

I'm just not sure how useful that would be for an actual desktop computer. That is, one you use to do actual work.

For a kitchen pc or something like that? A touchscreen would be great.

I think it has potential, especially after having used a tablet for a year now. I mean I'd love to just tap the screen to pause a video or change the volume. Editing PowerShell scripts not so much...

I dunno. I really can't see me wanting to reach over and touch my screens to do things. I sit kinda far away from my dual 24" setup. I can't even reach them from where I'm sitting right now. Not without leaning forward quite a bit.

That seems more a problem with the user and not the software

I'd say it would be a problem with the user if I had to stick my face up to the screen to use it. Especially with dual 24" screens.

[Melbosa]

All I know is you can still use a Win7 style desktop if you want

Sorta kinda. It's not the same desktop. No start button. The log off/reboot stuff is hidden in some obscure location on the Start Screen's side bar... Oh and you can't make it start in desktop mode by default. Every time someone found a way, MS locked it out.

OK well here I can tell you only really had the experience of it on my laptop or haven't given it a chance.  Start Button = Start Tab.  Opens and closes with the Start Key on your keyboard no different than with Windows 7.  Start Tab = As useful as Start Menu.  You couldn't have your Start Menu open and interact with a program... it would just close.  You couldn't interact with any other portion of your OS except the Start Menu if you wanted to keep the Start Menu up.  The Start Tab is NO different.

The Log Off/Reboot is still a mouse to the side, 2 click thing, no different than Windows 7.  Now there are keyboard shortcuts to shutdown/reboot which didn't exist before.

I'll give you the start in Desktop Mode thing.  That is not possible... but the more I use the Windows 8 Apps on the Start Tab through the Windows 8 UI (formally named Metro) the more I like the Start Tab on boot up.

Try before you bitch... and buy

[Mr. Analog]

I think it is still available for trial download

[Tom]

All I know is you can still use a Win7 style desktop if you want

Sorta kinda. It's not the same desktop. No start button. The log off/reboot stuff is hidden in some obscure location on the Start Screen's side bar... Oh and you can't make it start in desktop mode by default. Every time someone found a way, MS locked it out.

OK well here I can tell you only really had the experience of it on my laptop or haven't given it a chance.  Start Button = Start Tab.  Opens and closes with the Start Key on your keyboard no different than with Windows 7.  Start Tab = As useful as Start Menu.  You couldn't have your Start Menu open and interact with a program... it would just close.  You couldn't interact with any other portion of your OS except the Start Menu if you wanted to keep the Start Menu up.  The Start Tab is NO different.

The Log Off/Reboot is still a mouse to the side, 2 click thing, no different than Windows 7.  Now there are keyboard shortcuts to shutdown/reboot which didn't exist before.

I'll give you the start in Desktop Mode thing.  That is not possible... but the more I use the Windows 8 Apps on the Start Tab through the Windows 8 UI (formally named Metro) the more I like the Start Tab on boot up.

Try before you bitch... and buy

Why should I give a Tablet OS a chance on a desktop it clearly wasn't designed for doing real work. Everything they put in your face is there to display Twitter, Facebook, a calendar and some other random widgets. The desktop interface they have even felt tacked on, as an after-thought (I'm pretty sure it was), which leads me to believe it isn't even intended as a desktop/get-work-done OS.

[Mr. Analog]

Because your job, as an IT consultant, might require you to work with it.

"Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster"
~Sun Tzu

[Tom]

Because your job, as an IT consultant, might require you to work with it.

"Know your enemy and know yourself and you can fight a hundred battles without disaster"
~Sun Tzu

Hehe. Then I'll get used to it. I've already had to deal with OSX because I've been doing some iOS work. But as it is, I have absolutely no use for windows 8. And very little use for windows in general.